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"as part of that you probably want gain share and pain share, all the risk stuff."

That's fine. Until people realise that the independent sector view is that dealing with "all the risk stuff" has a cost attached to it.

If the risk proves to be higher than forecast, be ready for the sort of back tracking we've seen today with West Coast Main Line, but if it goes the other way (and indepdent sector "wins big") be ready for PFI-esque criticism.

In the meantime "all the risk stuff" doesn't sound too threatening does it?

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