Shadow health secretary Andrew Lansley has made what appears to be an open ended pledge on the size of the next NHS pay settlement, in an interview with HSJ.

Health secretary Andy Burnham told HSJ Andrew Lansley’s comments once again raised questions over whether his policy views and spending commitments had the approval of shadow chancellor George Osborne.

Mr Lansley said NHS pay did not depend on “how much money the government has”.

Pay makes up more than 40 per cent of total NHS spending - the pay bill was £36.5bn in 2007-08. NHS managers have said an early indication of what the next pay settlement is likely to be will help the service plan as it moves into a period of financial restraint. The settlement is due in 2011-12.

Last month Mr Burnham told HSJ talks between NHS employers and unions would be difficult in the absence of an overall funding settlement for the period after 2010-11 as agreements could not be signed.

But asked this week if he would welcome such talks, Mr Lansley said pay settlements should be based on the market rate rather than the government’s budget.

“Pay determination shouldn’t be set in line with financial allocations, it should be set in line with what is necessary to recruit [and] retain the workforce that you require,” he said. “It’s a fallacy to say the amount of pay for 2012-13 depends on how much money the government has.”

He said NHS pay should instead be determined by the local and national “pay environment” and added: “I see no reason why there should not be a collective negotiation about those things without government [being] involved.”

But Mr Burnham dismissed Mr Lansley’s comments as “nonsense”.

He said: “This is an astonishing statement from a man that wants to be health secretary. One wonders, yet again, whether Andrew’s musings on spending have been cleared by George Osborne.

“Recruitment and retention are important, but so is overall affordability. It is a nonsense to suggest the NHS should strike a deal now for two or three years hence without knowing the size of the spending envelope.

“Decisions of this kind can only be responsibly taken when we have a much clearer picture of employment and pay in the wider economy as we come through the downturn.”

The Conservatives have contested HSJ’s interpretation of Mr Lansley’s comments. Read their response to our story and Mr Lansley’s original comments in full as part of Sally Gainsbury’s blog.

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